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  • The Harness Thread, Schematics, Pics & Examples

    This is the harness thread, post your questions about car wiring and we will try to help you. If you make diagrams and can contribute, great. If you have suggestions for the first post, let's hear them!

    I am no longer in the harness making business, but I am happy to help out!

    Anyone can make their own harness, I didn't have any experience when I started, just needed something to work, and here we are today!


    Crimpless - Solder joints are a much better connection, acts like a solid piece of wire. *subject to debate*

    Heatshrink - your best friend for a watertight seal - electrical tape is ok, use it liberally. Heatshrink is also necessary for mechanically stabilizing solder joints. For example when you don't have a proprietary connector; solder wires on, and then heatshrink 4 layers or more on and around the plug so that when the wires are yanked, they pull on the plastic heat shrink tubing not the solder joints.

    Relay sockets - so you can replace your relays if they die and the user can actually do it themselves. female 1/4" spade clips are ok, but if you unhook them from the relay, you lose what wire goes where.

    No diodes! - unless you are using them for a specific purpose like passing power/ground to low beams from high beams in order to keep lows on while hitting your highs... IMO they are unnecessary. A relay socket replaces the need for a diode across the coil. If Bosch wanted diodes on their relays, they would have specified them. Replace the relay if it dies, don't alter your wiring to possibly extend the life of the relay.

    Split loom - makes a nice clean finished appearence the higher the temperature rating, the better.

    Silicone sealed relay sockets - to seal out moisture

    Wire - 14 gauge is about as large a gauge as I personally would use. 16 gauge is also fine for lengths < 6 feet.

    OEM male connectors - to attach to stock wiring to get your "triggers" for your relays. SUVLights or Rallylights has them for ~6-8$ a piece. Or you can cut off a bulb, solder wires on, and use heat shrink tubing to mechanically stabilize the socket. see heat shrink tubing.


    Hints

    A Butane torch is VERY useful for large solder joints of 3+ wires. Good joints should have the solder flow into the wire so it looks like a wrinkled rasin, not a ripe one!

    Some heatshrink tubing is rated at it's final shrink size, and some is rated at it's before shrunk size. There is 2:1 shrink or 3:1 shrink, also there is a dual wall kind where the inner layer melts, oozing out, creating a water proof joint.

    Radio shack heatshrink tubing sucks, don't write it off if you've had bad experiences with it.

    Helping hands are a necessity.

    Quick strip tools work great:



    Start with a Messy Table



    Get LOTS of wire



    Box of Split Loom



    Tons of Cable Ties





    Nice little butane torch for heatshrinking



    Soldering Station



    Strip back outter Jacket:



    Good solder joints



    Torching heatshrink



    Every joint gets heatshrink (or tape)



    Lots of connectors



    You can see this heatshrink tubing has an inner layer which melts, and oozes out to make a water tight seal. This is the good $hit



    Unused wires get terminated



    Battery Terminal:




    Final Product 9006 for 04/05 harness:



    Final Product for H4 02/03 harness:



    3 completed 02/03 harnesses for ECU EP, TrafficJamsEp, and Psylovibe



    Back of Headlights, quick disconnects soldered and mechanically isolated with 5 layers of heatshrink tubing.



    *Update, some diagrams*





    9006/9005/H1/H7 or any 2 pin bulb Upgraded Harness:



    Same thing but just 1 harness... You can use this for H1, H3, H7, H11, H9 etc... but NOT H4, 9004, or 9007. Any OEM bulb which takes 2 wires, you can use this for.



    H4 to 9005/9006 (dual filament bulb to 2x single filament bulbs) GROUND switched



    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...on_Harness.jpg

    H4, 9007, 9004 Positively Switched Bi-Xenon Only harness


    And an excellent schematic nicely donated by JAZZ (pg11) GROUND switched



    You have to know whether you have positive switched or ground switched. Honda civics 1999 and before are positive switched, 2000+ are ground switched.

    Ground switched and positive switched means exactly that, you are passing either power or ground. Positive switched is the most logical, you have ground always available, and just get a +12volt signal when the time is right. In a ground switched vehicle, you have a common positive always available, and get a ground when necessary.

    In an H4 socket, you have 3 wires, common, low and high. You basically need to find out if your common wire is positive or ground in the low beam position. Look an Sarosh's diagram below... this is what a positively switched H4 layout gives you:



    And here is a working schematic for POSITIVE switched H4 cars.




    Here is an additional schematic which keeps the low beams HIDs on when you flash to pass for up to 1 minute. Excellent for Bi-Xenon... Also by JAZZGROUND SWITCHED ONLY




    H4 Single Low beam HID Setup: GROUND SWITCHED ONLY!







    Many people wanted the low down on crimp vs. Solder... here's my opinion:

    Criming is definetly NOT better than soldering. Soldering is definetly NOT better than crimping. Each has a strength and weakness.

    My personal preference still is with soldering. I have seen many many crimped joints fail where as I have yet to see a solder joint in a harness fail.

    It's impossible to get 4, 12 gauge wires to stick in a crimp terminal, and this is often the requirement when making a harness. For small gauge wire up to 16 gauge, you can probably get up to 3, but forget using a crimp for anything greater than 16 gauge.

    I don't use a soldering iron because the gauge wire we use in harnesses makes all but the largest duty soldering irons ineffective. I use a blow torch. It gaurantees you will not have a cold solder joint, and it will wick up to create a much stronger joint than a crimp terminal could ever hope.

    However I do use crimp terminals for all quick disconnects, and will continue to do so. I also use them in small quick jobs, and have seen them used appropriately when you don't need to joint multiple wires.

    Crimps are quick and easy, and people tend to make more mistakes because of this. Soldering requires alot more concentration, and has the ability to make a much stronger joint.

    If you think about crushing metal together versus melting solder, resistance and durability wise, solder wins hands down.

    As for gas/water resistance, I use electrical tape. I use TONS of it, I may use half a roll per harness. Solder is cheap, crimp terminals like you suggest can be 0.50$ a piece... like these:


    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=095-914

    Imagine the price of stocking crimp terminals... it's very expensive and adds to the cost significantly.

    Here is the tool that I have:


    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=360-642

    Ratcheting Crimp terminal with various dies for stamping.

    Here is the torch I use for soldering harness joints:


    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=372-208

    If you're going to do this professionally to make money, it's faster to use crimps. But it is impossible to make good joints with multiple large gauge wire for harnesses like these require. And it creates a greater resistance than a good solder joint makes.

    The key is that it depends on the person making the harness. If you're sloppy, it's going to turn out sloppy with either method you use. If you want the best possible connection, solder offers a stronger joint (no arguing that metal is stronger than plastic) and you can make it every bit as water/gas tight with heatshrink that has a melting inner layer, or just wrap the shit out of it with electrical tape which I find to be the easiest and strongest mechanical joint because you can make it as thick as you want.

    Good solder joints are stronger, lower resistance, and cheaper than crimp joints. But they do take more time.

    Good Crimps are strong, minimal resistance, a tad expensive, but much quicker if you are going to churn out a ton of these.

    Each has it's strong points and benefits, and I've made hundreds of harnesses, and I will continue to use solder on all critical joints, and crimps on anything I want quick disconnects for. The readers are welcome to make up their own mind.

    Originally posted by houstinojillian
    this site may help if anyone's wondering about this too. http://www.classictruckshop.com/club...osch/relay.htm
    pic from there:




    __________________________________________________ _________
    Wire Gauge Question:


    Originally posted by koojo
    Ocelaris, I'm ordering all my wiring stuff, and have a question. I ordered all the same stuff as you listed on the first page of this thread (from partsexpress), and the the 5-pin relay socket has 3 14ga wires and 2 18gu wires. Now I'll be using 12 gauge wiring...wouldn't the the 5-pin relay socket act as a 'bottle neck'? Especially those 18ga wires...

    Also, using a 10ga wire coming off the battery fuse connects to one of the wires on the relay socket (30 spot), which is also a 14 gauge wire coming off of it.....is this okay? Seems like a lot of bottle necks.
    Here is an excellent site to prove that you're not losing much power to use 18 gauge wire... and you could use 18 gauge all the way around. Let's prove the benefits/problem with using various sized wires.

    When you use too small of a wire, you lose voltage because there is a resistance of the wire. Greater wire size, less resistance. But 18 gauge is not that much worse than 10 gauge really since there is such a low resistance already with 18 gauge.

    http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

    Standard 55watt Halogen Low beam @ 12 volts = 4.583~ Amps = 1100 lumens (halogen produces 20 lumens per watt) If it was really recieving all 12 volts it would be 1100 lumens, but since there is some resistance it's going to produce less. Let's be fair and say 10 feet for the longest run of any car/truck could use.

    18 gauge Wire = Voltage at load end of circuit: 11.397 so 4.583 * 11.397 =52.23watts *20 lumens/watt = 1044.65 lumens = 66 lumens lost.

    16 gauge wire = 11.618V so 4.583 amps * 11.618v = 53.245watts * 20 lumens/watt = 1064 = 36 lumens lost

    14 gauge wire = 11.762V so 4.583 amps * 11.762V = 53.905 watts * 20 lumens/watt = 1078 = 21 lumens lost

    12 gauge wire = 11.85V so 4.583 amps * 11.85V = 54.309 watts * 20 lumens/watt = 1086 = 13 lumens lost

    10 gauge wire = 11.906V so 4.583 amps * 11.906V = 54.565 watts * 20 lumens/watt = 1091 = 9 lumens lost

    6
    Now hot much is a lumen? A lumen is roughly 1 5mm LED... roughly, see here:

    http://led.linear1.org/lumen.wiz

    So you're getting diminishing returns, the difference in going from 18 to 10 gauge incrimentally is 30 - 15 - 7 -4

    So imagine 30 LEDs, is it worth it to go from 18 to 16 gauge, sure... what about from 16 to 14 gauge, you gain 15 LEDs... ok, sure... how about 14 to 12 gauge, now you gain 7 LEDs... mayyyyybeee... now 12 gauge to 10 gauge you gain 4 LEDs... It's just not worth it to me to go to 10 gauge.

    But for HIDs, the ballasts are a constant current/voltage power source, so no matter if you feed 10 volts or 15 volts, it will ALWAYS produce the same 85volts AC, no matter what. This is like a discrete number, either on or off. It either works or it doesn't with HIDs, so there is no point going past 16 gauge, 14 if you're pushing it.

    For the 10 inches of relay wire, you could use 22 gauge and probably not notice any voltage drop, go ahead and try it on the page above to prove it to yourself. 10 feet is a big distance, 10" is not.

    I can understand running 12 gauge for Halogen bulbs, but for HIDs, 16 gauge is plenty, and 14 is overkill.

    I'm going to put this on the front page because it was a good question, hopefully this answers your questions.

  • #2
    This is James281's post on page 6.





    here is where i got all my stuff.
    12GA wire.
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...5&ctab=15#Tabs

    bosch relay
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=330-070

    relay socket
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=330-075

    ATC IN-LINE FUSEHOLDER 10 GA
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=070-675

    Fuse
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...number=071-365
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...number=071-380

    1N4007 1A 1000V DIODE
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...tnumber=1N4007

    GOLD RING 10 GA. 5/16" 2 PAIR
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow...number=095-665

    wire loom
    http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=080-525


    lkstaack's E46 H4 to Bi-Xenon harness:

    Comment


    • #3
      I'm gonna go read that article before putting my foot in my mouth... here's an appropriate diode picture.

      Comment


      • #4
        Starting Fresh guys, you can search the other harness conversations, but start your questions. You can find the old harness threads here:

        http://www.hidplanet.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=28341

        There's another one called Harness Conversations 2 or Harness Diaries 2 somewhere, but couldn't find it... If not, just start a new question.

        Comment


        • #5
          I have a mitsubishi montero 1986 it's only came wiht 1 pair of headlight so it have h4 low and high but I am planning to retrofit with the TL's projector how do I connect the TL's to use the bixenon function in my montero?

          Comment


          • #6
            Most likely, you are going to have a positively switched H4 setup, so it would need this harness:



            If you want to be sure, test your H4 socket with this test:



            Ground switched = 2 grounds and 1 common positive
            Positive Switched = 2 positives and 1 common ground

            Basically test each socket for +12v and continuity to ground in each of the 3 states of off, low, and high beams.

            Comment


            • #7
              thanks for sharing here sir.. but after making my harness, where will i attached it? left side stock socket? or the other side? will it matter if attached to left? or right?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by etgo
                thanks for sharing here sir.. but after making my harness, where will i attached it? left side stock socket? or the other side? will it matter if attached to left? or right?
                It doesn't matter. All you are doing is powering the relay to switch power. A lot of people do the Driver side but its your preference. Just make your harness accordingly so it reaches one or the other.
                06 Regal Blue / Silver Subaru Impreza Outback Sport SE <-- Back-up Ride ( Tweaked STI HID Projectors)
                03 Classic Red Mazda Protege 5 <-- My DD ( HiD rEtRo “Still” In PrOgReSs )

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ocelaris
                  Most likely, you are going to have a positively switched H4 setup, so it would need this harness:



                  If you want to be sure, test your H4 socket with this test:



                  Ground switched = 2 grounds and 1 common positive
                  Positive Switched = 2 positives and 1 common ground

                  Basically test each socket for +12v and continuity to ground in each of the 3 states of off, low, and high beams.
                  That for h4 low and high to use the bixenon function in the TL's? Dude I am not an electrical guy :P for me that was like you talk to me in chinese. Someone can sell that? I will paid for that. hehe

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Yes, People do sell them, check in the BST forum, but you need to be a little proficient in order to tell them what you want.

                    I appreciate the help everyone gives in this thread, I try and keep up with harness questions, but I can't do it alone, and if someone really wanted to take over the harness thread leadership, write a how to etc... Assuming they were up to the job, I'd gladly hand over the reins.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      which diodes can be used from radio shack? (i didnt record them earlier)
                      2000 civic , bi retrofit
                      thanks

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        excellent looking harness, however one of the pictures is really disturbing to me

                        I would twist all the wires together, rather than a side by side soldering, although it could get a bit big for proper soldering. But overall good job. I like the adhesive filled heat shrink, I did not know they existed before looking at that thread

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Cracky
                          which diodes can be used from radio shack? (i didnt record them earlier)
                          2000 civic , bi retrofit
                          thanks
                          Pretty much any diode will work that is black with a silver/white stripe. They are rated by their breakdown voltage, i.e. how much voltage it can block going forward. 1N4001 is a 1 amp and 20v diode that is very common and acceptable for 12v electronics. 1N4002, 1N4003 etc.... usually just up the voltage blocking and/or amperage it can pass. So any of the 1N400# ones will work fine for Bi-Xenon solenoid use.

                          If you are using a diode for a bulb, i.e. a 9005, H1, or H7 etc... high beam, then you would want a 5 amp diode since 12v x 5 amp = 60watts roughly... 6 amp would be better, but 5 amp should be fine for that purpose. These you might have to get on ebay if radioshack doesn't have them.

                          Only diodes that are commonly available that aren't acceptable are the glass 1N4148 which aren't rated for enough current for regular automotive use, and are fragile.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by joeyl
                            excellent looking harness, however one of the pictures is really disturbing to me :

                            I would twist all the wires together, rather than a side by side soldering, although it could get a bit big for proper soldering. But overall good job. I like the adhesive filled heat shrink, I did not know they existed before looking at that thread

                            Yeah, you're right, it had been mentioned before, before I cleaned out the 17+ pages. Twisting will be better, It's been 2+ years since I made this thread, and my methods have improved. With that specific solder joint, I was bringing 2 wires together from each side, for a total of 4, and I already had twisted each pair together, so wasn't as easy to bring 2 sets of 2 together. With twisting, you need a little bit more length of wire.

                            It's better to twist, but it's not a huge deal if you don't either. It's a little bit better technically, but most if the benefit is asthetics. As long as the solder joint is wicked wet, you know you don't have a cold solder joint, which means the solder/flux isn't fully imbedded in each wire. And it's much easier to make a poor joint when just matching them up side by side. But for solid core wire, in that size, you can't really twist, only with stranded... so yes it's better, but either one when done properly will work fine.

                            with heatshrink, poking wires can short out if they poke through the heatshrink, so twisting is usually better. I always clean up the solder joints so there's nothing pokey to stick through the tape or heatshrink.

                            Thanks for the comment.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Ocelaris
                              Originally posted by joeyl
                              excellent looking harness, however one of the pictures is really disturbing to me :

                              I would twist all the wires together, rather than a side by side soldering, although it could get a bit big for proper soldering. But overall good job. I like the adhesive filled heat shrink, I did not know they existed before looking at that thread

                              Yeah, you're right, it had been mentioned before, before I cleaned out the 17+ pages. Twisting will be better, It's been 2+ years since I made this thread, and my methods have improved. With that specific solder joint, I was bringing 2 wires together from each side, for a total of 4, and I already had twisted each pair together, so wasn't as easy to bring 2 sets of 2 together. With twisting, you need a little bit more length of wire.

                              It's better to twist, but it's not a huge deal if you don't either. It's a little bit better technically, but most if the benefit is asthetics. As long as the solder joint is wicked wet, you know you don't have a cold solder joint, which means the solder/flux isn't fully imbedded in each wire. And it's much easier to make a poor joint when just matching them up side by side. But for solid core wire, in that size, you can't really twist, only with stranded... so yes it's better, but either one when done properly will work fine.

                              with heatshrink, poking wires can short out if they poke through the heatshrink, so twisting is usually better. I always clean up the solder joints so there's nothing pokey to stick through the tape or heatshrink.

                              Thanks for the comment.
                              Cool =D> I did not realize that thread was so long before. One thing that I was taught that is really helpful is when cleaning the solder joints, to go over it with a pair of needle nose pliers to gently crush the little strands poking out. Anyway thanks for this very insightful thread, I have definitely learned a lot from it

                              Comment

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